Darren Shearer—Create Thrilled Customers and Market Like Jesus

Darren Shearer—Create Thrilled Customers and Market Like Jesus

Darren Shearer shows you how to market your business like Jesus. Darren is the founder and CEO of High Bridge Media, a multimedia agency specializing in publishing and promoting the world-changing ideas of inspiring thought leaders. Its imprint, High Bridge Books, has published more than 100 books since 2013. Darren is also the director of the Theology of Business Institute, a global think tank with the mission of helping marketplace Christians to disciple their co-workers, companies, industries, and communities. He has authored three books, including Marketing Like Jesus: 25 Strategies to Change the World and The Marketplace Christian: A Practical Guide to Using Your Spiritual Gifts in Business. A former Captain in the United States Air Force, Darren earned the United States Air Force Commendation Medal for his meritorious service in Kuwait during Operation Iraqi Freedom. Darren and his wife, Marie, reside in the Great Smoky Mountains of Western North Carolina and have three young boys.

For those interested in publishing a book: www.HighBridgeBooks.com 

Christ-Centered Company Assessment: www.TheologyofBusiness.com/assessments

Theology of Business Podcast: www.TheologyofBusiness.com/podcast

If you have a book to publish for God’s glory, contact us at www.HighBridgeBooks.com. You can also check out Darren’s books, “Marketing Like Jesus: 25 Strategies to Change the World” and “The Marketplace Christian: A Practical Guide to Using Your Spiritual Gifts in Business”, at www.TheologyofBusiness.com.

Man’s Search for Meaning

Viktor Frankl

Entrepreneural Rollercoaster

Darren Hardy

Transcript
Pierce Brantley:

On the Eternal Entrepreneur, we believe faith comes by hearing and so do your business skills. You'll hear powerful stories and strategies to grow your business directly from Christian leaders. We've done it all before. Cactus on Mondays for lunch breaks are bite sized business series and twice a month on Fridays for faith inspiring interviews. Hello and welcome back. Thank you for joining us for the eternal entrepreneur. I am Pierce Brentley along with my cohost Joe Newton, and we not be more excited to share our conversation with Darren Shearer. As a former captain Darren earned the United States air force commendation medal. For his service and Kuwait during operation Iraqi freedom. From there, he founded hybrids, media and agency, which publishes world changing ideas from thought leaders. Darren is also the director at the theology of business Institute, a global think tank for marketplace Christians, a thought leader himself, his book marketing like Jesus will challenge you to market your business in new Christ, provoked ways.

Joe Newton:

Hey Darren, it is an honor to have someone of your caliber to get to talk with today. Thank you for taking the

Darren Shearer:

time. Wow. That's high praise. Thanks, Joe. Here's the gray really great to be with you. I've been looking forward to

Joe Newton:

this. Darren, can you give our audience a little bit of a backstory as far as w we heard you were in the military decorated in the military, and how did you get from there and to entrepreneurship and where along that journey did Christ decide he needed to join you?

Darren Shearer:

Yeah, I think I was always an entrepreneur. I had business cards when I was 11 years old for my little lawn business. And so I was going around, I didn't really have the whole pricing thing figured out. I was probably working for peanuts. I'd make some money and then get on my bike and ride down to the mall back when they had arcades. And then I would blow all my money. So it didn't really have a lot of good financial education at that stage in my life. But I definitely knew that I wanted to go and hang out my own shingle. So to speak. Yeah. That's how he got started in entrepreneurship. And then just fast forward into the military, I'm still an entrepreneur. I think the textbook term would be intrepreneur when you're working in a big kind of bureaucratic organization, like the United States government. And so I was always just looking for ways to improve things and improve processes. And therefore it does make a place for that as bureaucratic as it is. And so I really had an amazing experience in the air force in terms of when I really started to partner with God in my, in the workplace, I was leaving the base one day there at Barksdale air force base in Treeport Louisiana. And. I was driving over these railroad tracks, leaving the base, heading off to go do some good volunteer work through my local church. I'm a preacher's kid just wanted to be involved in what the local church was doing and was doing a lot of great volunteer work. And the Lord spoke to me and said, this base is your ministry. And that was really the moment where it all shifted for me to realize that God wanted to be. A whole lot more involved in what I was doing kind of nine to five, then just what I was doing in my volunteer work and playing on music teams and street evangelism and all of those wonderful ministries that the majority of us spend most of our waking hours working in a for-profit company. And so that's the origin story. So to speak,

Pierce Brantley:

Darren, I love that. Aye. When you first heard those, that impression from the Lord that this was your ministry, what kind of went through your head, being a PK and also having your own sort of journey going on there? What did you default to and how has that evolved if at

Darren Shearer:

all? Because I was so focused on, I think having grown, my dad was very much involved and sadly, my dad just passed away from COVID a couple of months ago, but I just thank God so much for his legacy. And he was the type of pastor that. He was going to get out and go stand in front of abortion clinics and counsel young moms that were about to go in and have their baby's life taken. And so he was doing a lot of things that aren't exactly, they don't exactly mesh with the traditional church growth strategies of, and so to his credit, he really set that example for me, that church is not just about what's going on inside the four walls, but what are we doing out? In the culture and really to his dying breath, that was the message that he was broadcasting nonstop, but I still just having been in churches and the way that pastors are there. The metrics that they're looking at aren't necessarily, what is the impact you're making in your workplace, but what are you doing within the church? For example, I wrote a book called the marketplace Christian about using spiritual gifts in the marketplace. And there's an assessment in there to help you identify, what are your gifts? Is it teaching administration? A lot of these gifts that. We're using in our businesses all the time. But when you take an assessment like that in a church, they're giving you the assessment, not to find out how are you going to use this in your everyday life, but how are you going to use this in a volunteer capacity in our local church? And so that's just anyone who's been around the church world for long enough, you start to realize that's what really is. Moving the needle in the minds of most pastors, that there are some there that are different, like my dad but that's, that was my deal, man.

Pierce Brantley:

First off. I'm so sorry about your father, but incredible legacy. Sounds like amazing guy. I think I can re resonate with. But with the whole church thing, I think I get scared of even filling out those surveys anymore because I don't know. Oh, going to get stuck on some minutes coming after you, man. They're coming after me. And I didn't even realize as I was late and all of a sudden I'm not teaching or administrating, but I love your heart in that because it's true. So often I think we, it's easy to put blinders our giftings and focus them in on places that we think are altruistic. Meaning they, they need to be given. For free or there's no value add in them. And the challenge, the aspirational challenge of, I think Christian entrepreneurship is that there was an opportunity to take these things that the new Testament talks about over and over again, and find a way of honing them in and having a value add. That is going to have influence in the community influence and the kingdom influencing and any kind of ministry capacity. And it's a shift. It is a shift and it's, I like it because it's a healthy challenge. I think you can't just go on the skirts of just volunteering it out of, if there's anything wrong with that, you have to focus it in and you have to be almost competitive with it. And that's a wonderful journey to take along side the Lord. It's cool.

Darren Shearer:

Yeah. And you got to realize that a lot of most pastors are. They're entrepreneurs and they've got essentially a business that they're running. And I don't mean that because I have a very high view of the calling a business people. When I say business, I'm not saying some sort of necessary evil, but there's just a different, there's a different focus. There's a different. Bottom line. Certainly we're all about the kingdom, but like you don't go into a tire shop Pierce. I know you just had a baby. You don't go into a tire shop and say, where's the baby food. They're like, we want babies to get fed. We just don't feed them here. That's just not really. And we also want people to have tires to drive on. Cause that's, it's not really safe to be out there driving without tires. So both are. Important value propositions. And I think it's like with the church, even though we have a lot of churches are trying to do everything and we put so many demands on pastors to be these like superheroes with every social issue has, they've got to get it's like how many sermons do you think they're going to preach in a given year? If there's 52 Sundays in a year and they're going to preach for maybe the 30, 35 minutes. Each of those Sundays, then they can't really hit everything that everybody wants them to hit, but they're going to hit something and it's going to be the unique message that God is, has given to them. They're going to emphasize something. And I think that's what we're all called to do. So I think we got to first start by letting our pastors off the hook and really as marketplace Christians, step up into the assignment, the calling that he's given to each of us.

Pierce Brantley:

Now is I'm curious, do you think that there are things that business leaders can learn from pastors from you have such a rich legacy there and then a followup on that? I'm curious how. All of this has led to leading with the business of theology Institute.

Darren Shearer:

Yeah. Yeah. So I went to seminary and pretty much all of my classmates intended to go and plant a church or start a nonprofit of some sort. But in most of those cases, as I have kept up with some of those classmates through the years, Almost all of them are working in for-profit companies now, which is interesting. And hopefully they have the, they don't have less of a quote unquote ministry mindset. Hopefully they don't feel like they're completely missing it by not being the pastor of a church, per se, as in a pulpit minister. Hopefully they are. Stewarding their calling as a business owner or as a manager of some sort, which by the way, is the main character in virtually all of Jesus's parables is a resource manager of some sort. And, but as far as what we can learn from churches, I think. Starting out, just having the mindset for an and pastors are doing the staff meetings or doing hiring firing. They're doing basically all dealing with zoning issues and all of the stuff that a business owner has to deal with for the most part. I'm

Joe Newton:

curious, Darren, it's interesting. It's a great perspective that you have with what you've built with all of your different avenues for education and empowering entrepreneurs, or what have been some of the most practical ways that you've seen that business leaders have been able to start to partner with their local churches so that they can both help each other in that

Darren Shearer:

vein. Yeah. I don't know if I would necessarily say, like when I did this research article, I wasn't saying necessarily that churches should operate like businesses. It really. Brings the question of what is a church like? Does it, is a church, something that gets incorporated or is a church, a fellowship of believers that can meet a break room. Like I saw at the United nations one time, or a couple of times actually went to worship with them. When I lived in New York city, there's a group of workers at the UN. From all different countries, you can think of that gather in this break room while people were coming in to sit down with their old bag of lunch and they're sitting right next to this. Like church service that's happenings. It's really pretty special, but I doubt they have the bylaws and the budget and everything like that. It's just that I think we muddy up what church is. As things get more, more institutionalized. The main thing I'm trying to do is to not to. Make church sound less sacred than it is, but to really raise the stature of the, sort of the spiritual stature of businesses. And because when we talk about making disciples, when Jesus talks about making disciples, as you go, where are people going? They're going to work. And that's where 85 in the United States, about 85% of the Christian workforce works in a for-profit. Company. That's where they spend 60 to 70% of their waking hours. And it's the same with the people that are not Christian. So if those Christians are going to be discipled is probably not just going to happen in a one hour church service. Once a week, average church attendance is actually considered just. Coming twice a month, which is a whole lot less now because the COVID or people just aren't going at all, but they're still going to work. And, but that's, what has to happen is that the spiritual stature, for lack of a better term of the Christ centered companies, a Christian led businesses has to be raised in the eyes of whatever we think of as clergy or just the church leadership and the world. And I'm not just talking about people that stand behind a pulpit.

Pierce Brantley:

There's a huge tendency, even for the Christian anyway, to silo church to Sunday, Sunday happens at the pews. And then after that, I actually have to get my hands dirty during the week. And we have things that are helpful, like home groups and everything else. And what typically happens is we take the stuff that happens during the week. We pile it onto a prayer meeting, and then we say, we're going to pray for you. Go get back to us and hopefully we get we hear testimony or something like that, but then we have to follow up with follow ups and there's this great opportunity. And the hours of nine to five 40 hours a week, 90,000, I think some hours total. And what happens is we have this great opportunity during the working day to participate in the great commission, to participate in discipleship, to participate in ministry and a way that opens up the lens of church. Much to really what it was like in the ax two environment. And oftentimes we say, oh, you hear churches all the time. Say we've got to get back to the act to George. We got to get back to that. Yes, but the actual church also. It says they were like meeting the colony. Like they were in the public, they were out, they were around, they were doing things and that's a great opportunity. It was to bring the testimony, the story of what God is doing in our lives directly to the people we are in contact with, through the opportunity of entrepreneurship or business or anything else and meeting people where they're at. Not for just a two hour sliver once a week. And I loved it cause it just widens the lens and church just a little bit.

Darren Shearer:

Yeah, I think of what I do as an extension of my local church. And I think of my business as, and I don't need my pastor to even tell me that because they didn't teach him that kind of theology and in their Bible school or seminary, but those of us who get it, like we really have to run with that understanding and teach that understanding to the other. Christian business professionals that your ministry in the marketplace, whether you run a business or you're managing anything at any level, that is an extension of the local church in your really inner city. When you think about it, because we think about how Paul addressed and John addressed. Letters. They were to churches. They were written to churches that were in a region, a geographical area. And it wasn't just two. I'm not talking about this church on this street corner. I'm talking about the one on the opposite street corner from there like that. I don't think the apostles really had that kind of a limited fragmented view of what the church was.

Pierce Brantley:

What's a cool story. Are you in a way that you've seen this workout practically and all the different things you do because you live in this every single

Darren Shearer:

day, not really try to practice that in my own company, starting out like we've and we're not a large company, a couple of employees, a couple of contractors, and, but seven of us gathered yesterday on zoom and had a meeting. We pray together and it gives me an opportunity to share what are the, I told him yesterday, Hey, this company is founded on the cornerstone and the cornerstone it says in Ephesians is Jesus. He is the chief cornerstone. So I don't think that just applies in terms of a spiritual sense of the overall church, but even down to on the. Most atomic level. I think our marketing practices, Jesus ought to be the cornerstone of that, of our HR practices. Jesus ought to be the cornerstone of that as well as the company overall. And so that, that's just something that I was encouraging them with yesterday. And now we want to be one of our core values is encouragement. I'm not a great encourager. That's really not one of my strongest gifts, but I've just seen, we work with authors and I've seen how much. These authors and clients need that encouragement and validation when they're turning their manuscript over to you. Pearcey, you know this as an author, like it's a very, and you just had a baby and there's some commonalities there. When your book comes out into the world is a little bit like your baby. Coming out into the world and just some things like that, but there are organizations like C 12 and convene and FCCI and these fellowships of Christian companies that are truly run on biblical principles. And there's just so many companies doing this. Yeah,

Pierce Brantley:

no, by the way, every author that, the reason they write a book. Is just to get that encouragement bucket filled up. There's a hidden need there. Oh, absolutely. That's a joke, but it's true. I think there's always the Lord kind of turning something that there's always a gap there and the wound, and then he heals, it creates something good from it where we plan something in the person. Let's talk a little bit about your book. So marking like Jesus provocative title, but I love it. And I think that there is a lot to learn from the fact that what he did 2000 years ago, he had some help. He's got the holy spirit is God in flesh. But talk to me, talk to us a little bit about what you were able to observe through his life and a little bit about some of the principles in the book.

Darren Shearer:

Yeah, and I believe in signs and wonders and everything, but like the strategies are not things like go raise the dead, good. Raise somebody from the dead and then put it out on social media and see what kind of positive response you get. That's not go viral. Try to do this book. As I say, in the preface is not a religious book. It is a business book. It's a marketing book. But we're learning from the ministry of Jesus and how he connected with people to get his message across. And so I think marketing really goes through five functions, starting out with serve first, you got to serve people, figure out what you're good at doing in terms of what service you're providing. And then target fi figure out who needs that who's already coming to you for that, then connect is the third function and then lead those people. And then the fifth one is to multiply, which is really more of a by-product of doing the first four. And then within each of those five functions, there are various strategies. So for example, Defining your target group. A lot of people would say, Jesus didn't have a target group because he loved everybody. God, so loved the world. Yeah. Go into all the world, make disciples. He had enormous vision, which we ought to have. We ought to have, but during his short window of time on earth. He had a very select group of people that he was focusing his time on. And he defined that as the lost sheep of the house of Israel. So it was a specific ethnic group. And then the lost sheep were the ones on the fringes of that. Very tiny ethnic group. The people that were his disciples, basically the ones that were on the fringes, not the ones that were the rich and powerful, the ones that were the Pharisees and so forth. You would have taken a completely different approach if he was going after people like that. But he brought on these ordinary fishermen, for example, because they represented his target group. I don't know if he necessarily planned it. This way, but certainly it's hard to think about in terms of how he was able to determine what type of career he would have, but he was a blue collar worker, which was another way that enabled him to identify with his target group. So I think having a target group is one of the most important things in working with authors. I'll ask them, who is this book for? And they'll say, oh, this book is for everybody. Yeah. We want everybody to read it, but not, everybody's going to read it. In fact, a tiny. Fraction of people are actually going to re Pierce. Maybe your book is different. So you have to decide who is that somebody and just go all in on that type of person. I'm curious.

Joe Newton:

Have you had any feedback as it, just with the title and things to where people assume or get a little offended when you're like marketing, like Jesus. Like, how dare you. Is that any feedback that you originally had or was that a intentional

Darren Shearer:

and the title actually gotten more pushback on the concept of using spiritual gifts in business that I have on the concept of marketing, like Jesus, because when you think about with, I think if you frame it as. Then the way that I define marketing is strategic influence. It's deliberate influence. It's not just, I'm randomly influencing people, but you're very intentional about it. I think people can, th that's somewhat palatable for people, but for. In terms of spiritual gifts, I think. Yeah. Cause you got some camps of Christians that don't believe that the spiritual gifts are for today at all. And then you have the Pentecostal charismatic crowd who have been taught that the, and they'll say this to me, spiritual gifts can only be used in a congregational settings. So things like prophecy and tongues and. Things like that. So I take a gift like administration. So if I'm, how am I using a gift of administration in my only using that if I'm counting the offering or if I'm like counting attendance or something like that, is that the only use of the gift of administration. And then I go into my business and I'm doing administration, what is that? What am I doing then? Am I just operating in the flesh? And so I just have to break it down. Like that to you gotta explain to me how does that, oh, that's a talent. That's a natural ability. That's a talent. That's not a spiritual gift. And I'm at the point now where I believe I'm either operating in spirit and the gifts or I'm operating in the flesh. And I think there are probably more gifts than the ones that are listed there in the Bible. Like for example, connecting, I think people have some people have a gift of connecting. People like the networkers that, and that is a, that's a really powerful gift, but yeah, I've actually gotten more pushback on that one. Believe it or not. Yeah. And

Pierce Brantley:

I've talked about this before, but I love his heart on it so much because you don't the spirit of God infuses a skillset, when Christ comes and he creates a new woman, a new man. All of a sudden I am transformed, right? The gift that I have on this side of transformation is different on this side of transformation in Christ. I'm a new creation. That means everything is affected by that. And we see specific examples of that, like with opiod rehab and in the old Testament where these guys are like construction workers or leaders, They're just talented people. And then the spirit of God rests on them. And just like it did with Saul, the Bible says all of a sudden they were changed to another man. All of a sudden they were changed to a different person, a different woman, regardless of where you're at in that. And I think the hangup. It's almost an offense. And it's something that I think you're right there and it has to be broken down gently with a spirit of a meekness and say, Hey, listen, you may have opera that are new to false assumption. And that a false assumption is that you need to have the gift of prophecy or the gift of tongues or the gift of words, knowledge, or whatever, the higher gifts as we like to think of them in order to be an effective. Christian, but the Bible talks about both. And when that thing is submitted to the Lord, whether that's your leadership, whether that's connecting, whether that's your ability to create really good standard operating procedures, when you were abiding, that thing becomes something completely different. And you almost have to be aware that your heart can get offended in it a little bit and say, I'm going to surrender that Lord. What have you given me as inventory? I've put it at your feet. And what can come of it. And that's Darren, just what you're talking about. That's where the good stuff happens. That's where entrepreneurs, all of a sudden, they have fruit in their business. That looks like the fruit that you see in a ministry setting, because the same thing simply because of surrender simply because they'd take an inventory and they've given it back to the Lord. In a present state of mind. So I

Darren Shearer:

love where you're just speaking on that teaching peers saw on the anointing. I know that's a big part of what we talked about last time. And we might say that the difference, because this is a pretty common question. What's the difference between a natural ability and a spiritual gift? I think it's the anointing, I think in one word, the anointing,

Pierce Brantley:

that's it. And you can see it on people. You can see it on people and oftentimes we've mystique the word for whether it was intentional. We're not intentional. We've said, you know what? The anointing is for people who are anointed. The Bible is very clear in Christ. His children are anointed and it's simply saying, Lord, I didn't know. I had access to this part of the life. What have you given me? And I'm telling you spreadsheets, digging, ditches, painting, anything that you can imagine, anything that your heart gravitates toward. That the Lord has put in. You can Edify the body can bring people to a saving knowledge of Jesus Christ. You look at this is pre Christ, but totally underneath the weight of God, you just look at Solomon and the queen of Sheba, and she looks at his table and goes that silverware couldn't have happened that way, unless God was somehow involved. Anything can bring someone to a saving knowledge of Jesus.

Darren Shearer:

That's right. And I, another way that I think we ought to think about the gifts is that they are, yes, it's the anointing, but they are fueled by the fruit of the spirit. So if I'm, I know I'm operating in the flesh, if selfish ambition is what is fueling my gift of administration or gift of leadership or whatever, you're right. Whatever your gift is what ought to be fueling. It is the fruit of the spirit. Love, joy, peace, patience, all of the different fruits. Actually. We're teaching that to my boys right now who are two, the two year olds. He's not exactly into it right now, but my five-year-old my seven year old. And they've got th they talk about the love. Apple, the joy, watermelon, the peace peach, the patients' pineapple. And then we got one for all the different fruit. And so if we're lacking something, you need to go take a bite of that watermelon. You better go. You're anxious. You better go take a bite of that peach. And they know exactly what the corresponding fruit is, but that's what. I think the anointing God is into anointing ability, turning it into a gift when we allow it to be fueled with kindness, with goodness, with gentleness, with faithfulness, self-control all of those different fruits that are so valued.

Pierce Brantley:

No, it's so true. You look at you say, I love the term you used earlier. The intrepreneur you'll get Stephen in the old Testament, right? The original and the disciples are like, Hey. We've got to go do real ministry, waiting on tables is not a good use of our time, which is fair, but it's a crack of the Bible records. And what happens against Stephen? It was the Bible say about Steven. It says, I think three times, at least two times. It says Steven was a man that was full of the spirit, working in signs and wonders doing miracles among the people. And it says the Erie iterates it for emphasis a couple of different times over and over again. And you had, what was Steven's job? He worked at a food bank. He was the first food bank that had a Christian oriented origin and it, and oftentimes I think the reason. We think that partnering with God in a business is meant for someone else is because we don't realize that he is working through the mundane and the mundane is what manifests the gifts of God so quickly. It's not that there are in other places, but if you think that you're going to wait for a mountain top moment where you're gonna be waiting your whole life, you really are realize that even can be transformed. And that sense of even you said it earlier, that I could be in the flesh or I could be in the spirit, just recognize that you want that, that you want to partner with God and that's a shift and all of a sudden man, take a bite of that piece speech and you're going to see some good stuff happening in whatever you're doing. I love it. Yeah.

Darren Shearer:

Yeah. It's so it's been so fun to, to go through that with the boys. And like, all of this is just, nobody learns more than the teacher and now we're into the spiritual armor. So the armor is what guards. Your fruit and your capacity to produce the fruit, because what is the enemy want to do? He wants to come in and first of all, take all your peace. Take all your joy and take away your means of production. That's what he's after. And cause if he can shut that down, he'll he can shut your gift down. He, and he can just keep you operating in the flesh. Th that's all you're, that's all you're left with. So right now we're going through the belt and the breastplate of righteousness and yeah. Yeah. We'll have them stand up, put the belt on the belt of truth on chink. And because we gotta, you gotta know what the promises of God are. And then the breastplate of righteousness we'll stick our we'll stick our chest out like that, because that breastplate of righteousness is I'm in right. Standing with God. I know the promises. I know the truth and I know what it tells me that I'm in right. Standing with God. So no matter what's going on in the economy, what's going on, I've got maybe business. Isn't doing so good right now, but I'm in right standing and you can stand up and stick your chest out and be proud to know that you are in right standing with God. And so we're actually going through the rest of them right now. It's a lot of fun.

Pierce Brantley:

That's so good. Darren, your inspiration as a leader to our nation, as a CEO, as an Institute, founder, as an author, as an inspirational father, man has, we could continue this conversation for, I think, for another couple of hours and we wouldn't have hit the bottom of the bucket with you. So I really appreciate you sharing your time with us before we went out of time. We want to go to Joe's famous. Five his questions, Joe, I'll give it to you, but it gives our listeners a little opportunity to get to know you

Joe Newton:

better. All right, Darren, as pier said, we have our famous five here. So question number one. What are the, your top three must read books. And I know for you, this is probably a little bit harder than a lot of our guests considering your business, but not including the Bible. And these can be business, family, spiritual, even your favorite cookbook.

Darren Shearer:

See, I love man's search for meaning by Viktor Frankl. It's a relatively short book, but whatever you got problems, go read man's search for meaning it, read about what it was like in a Nazi concentration camp as a Jewish psychiatrist and just the mindset. That he had in the middle of that. I've been reading a lot of biographies lately. One is Ron Chanel's, Ulysses S grant biography. I just, and I'm doing this audibly by the way, because maybe I just got burnout so much from editing books that now I pretty much do everything through audio. Another one for entrepreneurs that's actually really good and really inspiring is the it's by Darren Hardy, the author of the compound effect, founder of success magazine. But it's the entrepreneurial rollercoaster. I would highly recommend that, especially for. Entrepreneurs young and old. It will be a great encouragement, extremely practical and motivational as well. And it's on, you can get that one actually for free. If you have audible membership. Yeah. It's you don't have to use up your credit on it at least last time I checked. Awesome.

Joe Newton:

Cause I'll give the amen that there's no shame in using audible to to read some books. Absolutely. I'll be adding those. For sure. Sorry. Question number two. Sorry. You got me thinking about books here. You can send a note card back to yourself when you're first starting off on your entrepreneurial journey. What are the three pieces of advice you're putting on that card? Three

Darren Shearer:

pieces of advice. I would say, do what don't give into the cause I went to business school up in New York city and. They made it seem like, unless you're trying to start the next Facebook or Google your business, doesn't matter. It's not scalable. That's I would say don't give into that peer, especially if you studied business and grad school or something like that, there's a lot of pressure to just go that route, but do you really to take a good look at what the gifts are that God has given to you? What the experiences are and just recognize God wants to use. The way he's already wired you. Yeah, I would say fine. Somebody who has been there done that to some extent, and that would be probably answers. Number two and three go. Just find somebody that can coach you down the right path. I would say, find an individual, find a peer advisory group. That's what I would,

Joe Newton:

I'm curious, is that something you eventually did connect with, whether it was a C 12 or something like that, that you became a part

Darren Shearer:

of. Yeah. So it's an image that I have been in several mastermind groups, peer advisory groups. And what I have found is that unless somebody is getting paid to facilitate that it's hard for it to really be sustainable. You're going to benefit from it. But if it's like a group of friends is I got this call today, or I got a prospect, something like that. It's easy to just let. Just skip the meeting, but I would say get an organization that is. Charging something where you got some skin in the game, it theology business Institute. We were actually about to launch some of those and they're called cornerstone advisory groups. Because again, Jesus is the cornerstone and he ought to be the cornerstone of our HR, of our marketing, of accounting, everything that we're doing at business. And that's what we're up to at the theology of business

Joe Newton:

Institute. That's awesome. And having run those types of groups and been in them as well. I, yeah, there's just something about investing in yourself and having some money on the line. Question number three now, how do you define success stories?

Darren Shearer:

Yeah, I think success is cultivating the spiritual fruit and having the armor to protect it. And because that's, the calling is. To bear fruit and that's the kind of fruit Jesus was talking about. The fruit isn't necessarily go make money, go, even go make conference. It's go. It's actually to go and make disciples. So as we're cultivating that spiritual fruit, the commission is to go and make disciples. And so that's really how I define success. And disciple-making, isn't just on a one-to-one basis, but you can represent, need people to run your company.

Joe Newton:

I love the. Become like a child and all things. So I'm going to be stealing your fruit exercise analogy both for my 17 month old. But I feel like there's something to like, even as us adult entrepreneurs, finding even those simple ways to remind ourselves of walking out the fruit and getting our minds back in that perspective. That's so good. Yeah.

Darren Shearer:

Yeah. However, we're either eating the good spiritual fruit like that. Joy watermelon or we're eating that rotten depression or we're eating. Just whatever that rotten thinking is that the devil is serving up to us. Anytime we want it. Anytime we don't want to do the work to cultivate it. The holy spirit is going to cultivate it, but we have to plan it and water it. All right.

Joe Newton:

Question number four when times have gotten tough. What's kept you from got

Darren Shearer:

to pay the bills, right? That's a big, some good Hardy laughter going on. People can't hear. Cause you're muted. Sorry about it. Yeah, it didn't want to distract. Yeah, that's a big part of what kinda got me going and kept me going is I got married and I can't just keep dabbling around in these startup ideas. I got to make something happen for my family. And yeah, that was in terms of jumping ship from what I'm. Currently doing, it's just the peace of God. And just knowing that you're doing what you're supposed to be doing and you don't have to go chase the next shiny object and go look at the fast company article on 10 hottest industries coming up. And I got to go that direction, but now just stay faithful to what God has put in your hand and, but hold it lightly.

Joe Newton:

Pearson. I like to say quite a bit that it's not sexy. It's just business. And sometimes you don't need a really fancy answer. Just I gotta pay the bills and try to do what I feel like I need to do. All right. Darren question number five. What should we have asked that we

Darren Shearer:

didn't? What should we have asked? I don't know. How do I publish a book? Go to hybrids, books.com and reach out to us. And we'll talk to you about. Publishing your book. I think people that are interested in learning more about spiritual gifts, you can go and get a hold of the assessment. If you get the book, the marketplace Christian, it has the assessment in the back, but you can also get it at our website as well. But. There's also another assessment. If you've got a theology of business.com forward slash assessments, you'll get a hold of our Christ centered company assessment, which will take you through 54 different areas of your business from accounting management, marketing, HR, business, law, everything, and each of those items are, have a scriptural foundation. To them. And that reference is there in the assessment and take the assessment and see how you're doing and track it over time. Galdjie of business.com forward slash assessments. I'm all about having practical tools. And that's the one we came

Joe Newton:

up with that's I actually had that pulled up right before we got on. I was. Taking a look at that and we'll have the link for that in the show notes, for sure, because there's no reason to reinvent the wheel. And if someone's already put all of that time and energy in creating something like that, go take the assessment and save yourself a lot of time to start putting some practicals to work. That's good. Yeah. Thank you, Darren. Again, so much for spending this time with us. And I don't know if we mentioned it or not. Darren has an amazing podcast that all of you, most likely, if you're listening to this one, you're already listening to his, but if not, take the time, look it up. He's got some amazing guests on there and Darren, I hope we can have you back again.

Darren Shearer:

Yeah. Love it. Joe Pierce. Really a pleasure. I love what you guys are doing.

Pierce Brantley:

Thank you for listening. If you enjoyed the show, do me a favor and leave a quick review. When you do it helps other entrepreneurs find this content and benefit from it too. See, next week.

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