Eternal Entrepreneur Podcast

Ellis Hammond on How to Build Community

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What does it take to build community, and what are the actions you should take to create a successful team or group within your Kingdom Business? In this episode, Ellis Hammond, Owner of Kingdom REI, the #1 Mastermind Community for Entrepreneurs and Investors, talks about his incredible journey to build a Christian business which thrives by bringing people together through marketplace ministry.

Episode Transcription

Hey, this is Ellis Hammond with Kingdom REI and the Kingdom REI podcast. And if you want to create an impactful kingdom business, you should be listening to the eternal entrepreneur podcast. My good friends, Joe Newton and Pierce Brantley.

The Eternal Entrepreneur gives you the stories and strategies to gain freedom. As a Christian business leader, you’ll hear from real entrepreneurs who have learned how to partner with God. From making millions to filing bankruptcy. These are honest stories to help you hear God’s voice and build a lasting legacy through business.

Well, hello and welcome back. And thank you for joining us for the Eternal Entrepreneur podcast. I’m Pierce Brantley, along with my co-host Joe Newton, and we could not be more excited to share with you our conversation today with Ellis Hammond. Ellis is the founder of kingdom REI. The number one Mastermind community for Christian real estate entrepreneurs.

He also manages his own network of investors who see passive opportunities and apartment complexes across the U S but his own entrepreneurial journey began when he was still a full-time college pastor. Before we jump into the interview today, want to ask if you’d help us out by leaving us a five star review and sharing the podcast with a friend.

And also if you’d like to stay in touch and get a free copy of the first chapter of my book, calling how to partner with God and any business with any boss at any place in life. And click on the link in the show notes to sign up for our weekly email or visit eternal entrepreneur.com now onto the interview.

Thank you so much. It is awesome to have you here. My bio is way more sexy when you read it. So thanks for that. Appreciate it. We’ll get that recorded and sent over to you so you can, [00:02:00] well, Ellis. I want to jump in because we only have you for a little while. So we heard your journey really started way before you got into real estate.

Before you had the podcast, you were a campus pastor. And everyone knows that a campus pastor is rich and invest in multifamily apartments. And we want to know how did you start living out that entrepreneurial life? And yeah. Yeah. Everyone knows you’re joking because everyone knows a lot of times pastors are broke.

Most college pastors can barely buy groceries. Right? Yeah, we did. So, yeah. Yeah, we were fine. Not making a lot of money. We didn’t get into ministry to make any money by any means. We love what we did, man. We were building communities of Bay here in San Diego on college campuses. And we did that for about six years, but I don’t know, probably like four years into our ministry.

We just. I mean in a lot of ways, you’re out of money in a sense of like, Oh, our [00:03:00] team was beginning to really grow. We were building a team here in San Diego and, um, we just wanted to figure out better ways to create capital and that never thought we would be come a full-time entrepreneur. I always thought I would do full-time vocational ministry, but really wanted better vehicles to build wealth in.

And, uh, but I had no idea how to go do that. And, um, and so we just got hungry, man. Like I just started asking questions and the first thing I ever heard was a radio ad that said, Hey, if you want to learn how to build wealth through real estate, come to this two hour seminar. And I mean, it hit me at the right time.

And I was like, well, I got nothing to lose. I don’t know anything else. And so I went to this two hour seminars the first time I ever saw. Kind of normal Joe’s right. Like those guys who didn’t come from big Wells don’t have a huge real estate background, but they were telling their stories about how they started building wealth through real estate.

And that changed my life. And it was the first time I say that it’s like I was taught the real estate was the end game for the wealthy. And it was the first time I think I [00:04:00] realized that real estate was actually the starting point. For all of the willing to go and build wealth. And so it changed my life.

And so four months after that, we ended up buying our first duplex and we can get into that story if you’d like, but that was kind of the beginning. Yeah. When you say we, do you feel like this was a, a change of mind that just you had, or was it you and your wife, both that kind of at the same time, we’re, we’re having that change of perspective because I know with me and my wife, we don’t always go at the same level.

Yeah, that’s a great question. Now my wife probably thought I was crazy and definitely still thinks a lot of what we’re doing. And we’re now settling. We’re actually in the process about two weeks from selling that for suplex. So no, like no to all the earliest husbands out there, like if you’re about to make some massive transition, eight months into your marriage probably don’t do it like 10 o’clock at night, late in bed.

Right. So if anybody’s listening, let me say view. Right? And so not, [00:05:00] I have so many ideas. I’m such a visionary that when I started telling my wife this she’s like, okay, But I gave me, I was obsessed of like going to change our financial position and we’re going to help people along the way. And I just kept talking about, I kept learning and kept trying to educate her along the way.

So no, it was slowly, slowly and steadily. And I think part of it has been through this process of. Us buying duplex. And then we moved into this duplex and then we moved out of the duplex and then we bought our first apartment complex, her like seeing it it’s kind of really brought us in line or like now you’re selling her home.

We’re going to actually go rent again. And she’s on board. Cause she gets, she gets the process of like, we’re we say this all the time, that will, we’re paying the price now so that we can pay whatever price we want to later. And part of that is making decisions, like selling your house and moving into a rental.

And that’s part of our journey. Right? I think that’s so good. And. And learning to communicate with your wife on the entrepreneurial journey, because I [00:06:00] know a lot of people listening are probably similar to you and I, that we get something in our head. We see it. On the Hilltop and we just want to go after it.

But if we forget to properly communicate to our wives, the things that we’ve learned when they weren’t standing there right there with us, that can cause a lot of trouble. And I think that’s really good that you were able to, to walk her in and go at her pace as well. Yeah. I mean, I don’t know if I ever did that perfectly.

I don’t know if anybody. But no, I mean, you’re totally right, man. And, um, I’m so grateful to have a supportive wife and, you know, even when we lost our business kingdom, REI, there was a lot of, kind of pushback we got there, but the one steady relationship was my sweet wife. And so, yeah, I mean it is having a, being able to create a safe Haven in your home.

And in your marriage, especially as Rocky as entrepreneurship can be is, is really key. So, yeah, absolutely. Yeah. Will you go into that story as far as how you got [00:07:00] that first duplex and what that looked like? Yeah, for sure, man. So. We just started learning this study, or I started learning and studying and knew that we wanted to buy a unit because we could, we could rent out one of the units, but tend to live in another one of the units.

Like I knew we had to get somebody else paying our mortgage because that’s really an asset. That’s what makes it a home and asset, not alive. Praise when you have one. Paying mortgage. And so here in San Diego, we, it was a duplex. Something about buying a San Diego is a duplex, was over half a million dollars and we didn’t have that much money.

And so we had a family, an investor actually helped us put the down payment on the duplex. And then my wife and I went to work and re have one of the units that we actually lived in. And so the way we bought that first duplex was we found out. A mentor, someone who kind of, I think felt sorry for us and was like, Hey, I’ll help you find a deal and kind of help you into the process.

And so that really was how we did it, man. We found someone that we could kind of ask questions to and. He was incredibly helpful in [00:08:00] us finding this project and, and just knowing what to look for and what to, what to do. And we did really well. I mean, we, we bought one of the ugliest houses on a, in a pretty good neighborhood.

And within about 11 months we created over a hundred grand in equity. And then refinance that deal, be able to pull some of that capital back out and then we’ve held on to it for the last couple of years. And yeah, man, we’re about to sell this property for, I mean, we’re going to two X, our capital to XR investment way more to XR investment, like.

Two X the purchase price. I mean, we’re going to three or four X our investment. So that was a great start. Yeah. That’s an awesome, I love that you had that, that one little, when you guys put in a lot of sweat equity to make it happen, you found a partner who you had to split it quite a bit with, but y’all were able to, to get that, that win and then go on to the next.

Yeah. And then just like getting in. I just remember thinking, like, after I leave in that seminar, I was like, what do I gotta do to get this first deal? What am I going to do? And just hearing like, [00:09:00] Take continue to take action. And for me, I knew what, like most things in my life, it was going to come through the relationship.

Like I needed it. I wasn’t going to have to do some of my own. I just think that’s an important principle in entrepreneurship too. I mean, you gotta be, you gotta know you assess whatever your cause is or what you’re going after and be evangelistic about your cost rather than we told everyone, listen, we’re, we’re trying to buy real estate.

We’re trying to buy a deal. And just through those conversations, someone’s like, well, you need to meet this guy. And so I went and met this guy and literally that was how we, I owe everything to that first mentor because I don’t, we would have not gotten started that fast and done has done as well in this deal without him.

And then the same is true in buying a first apartment deal. And having someone kind of take us under their wing and do it that way. And my business partner, Tina Marie, I, you know, like this is so much of our success has come from really aligning ourselves with good people. And finding success together.

So I think that that’s been a huge kind of part of our journey. So [00:10:00] Ellis, I think that’s amazing how you’ve took that first step and I’ve got to see, see the fruit of it. Can you tell me a little bit about kingdom REI? Did those two kinds of desires overlap, or where did that kind of that mastermind community?

Where did that get birthed out of. Yeah. So Kanombe REI is a mastermind community for real estate operators, accredited investors, um, that we started in 2020. And no, dude, I’ll be honest with you, man. So that there’s an investment to be part of this group. And it’s several thousand bucks and I never a net like, so we’re in November of 2020.

If you’d asked me in October 20 of 2019, That I felt we would have a mastermind community where people would pay that type of money to be a part of. I would not believe because I didn’t have that belief in myself and I didn’t see the value that I really could bring to a community like this. I was good at building communities because I did that on the college [00:11:00] campus.

But to think that I had enough value to bring to a group or could create enough value. As someone would be willing to invest this type of money to be a part of it. I just wouldn’t believe you. And so, no, that was never really part of my concept. Again, it was having people speak life, enemy, speak, truth, enemy playlists.

Here are the gifts that God has made you with. Here’s why we think you’re valuable. Here’s the price that we think you should charge for something like this. And so, again, it was kind of that it was a, it was a real process, man, but the desire for kimari, I was, we were in ministry and we were in business right.

Doing real estate. And I had a great. Ministry community and church community. And I was growing in our relationships kind of in the real estate world, but I always felt like I was just like everyone. Like I could talk about God. Like there was this real kind of safe space. Talk about God here in the ministry world, but super brand knows.

I love Jesus. And I love the real estate in entrepreneurial world [00:12:00] because I’m super ambitious and super hungry, but it just felt like I couldn’t really be ambitious over here in the ministry world. Then I couldn’t really be myself in the real estate world. And so we were like, man, we really want to start a community where both of those things can come together where we can be ambitious as Christ followers.

Wow. And so that was kind of the start of kingdom REI. And had no idea if there was anyone else out there like me and come to find out there are, we have 40 of them in our community now. So that’s kind of been the birth of kingdom, Mario. I love how you said you, you highlighted the word ambition and I love that you did that because.

I think oftentimes as a Christian in particular, it can almost be this, this fear or this condemnation that says, Hey, listen, ambition is a worldly kind of attribute. Even CS Lewis talks about some of that type of stuff. And there really [00:13:00] isn’t a place for it. So you can either live in ministry world, or you can live in the entrepreneurial world, but you can’t do both.

And so what actually ends up happening is because we don’t know really what to do with this hunger, with this drive. If we don’t have a lot of freedom in it, Cause we isolate and we don’t actually build a community around us as an entrepreneur because we think, well, we need to kind of pursue this on our own because it’s not validated.

You’ve kind of taken the opposite approach and you’ve said, Hey, listen, come one, come all, this is a journey we need to be in it together. It’s actually more fruitful for us to kind of, to be in community. And then you built that up. And I love that because I think ambition needs accountability, but it also thrives to in a healthy sense when it’s with other people that you can learn from and who can keep you in check and can just encourage you along the way too.

Yeah. A hundred percent, man. No, I totally I’m totally with you. And I do think it’s yeah. I mean, it’s why I love this show right here. You’re the eternal entrepreneur. Like I just think we [00:14:00] gotta start making a space, man. If we really want to see the kingdom grow and be advanced in this day and age, like. To really elevate the gifts of entrepreneurship and gifts in the marketplace, and really see that there’s a space for really ambitious minded people that can, most of the time, you think ambitious Christians and Christians that have gifts of skills with communication and building like typically, what are they told they should go meet.

She’d go be a church planner. You should go and be a pastor. And I mean, that’s what I was told. Right. I mean, now that you’re gifted, I can communicate my boss. Like you’re going to be a great pastor. I just thought like, I didn’t even, it wasn’t really wasn’t even a Christian. It was around Christian people.

But back then, it was always like, well, the best way to serve God is to when I became a Christian, it was full, be a missionary. Like this is the best way to really serve God. And so, yeah, I just think that’s why I love this is elevating this role of entrepreneur in the kingdom of God that, Hey, there’s a [00:15:00] place for you.

And it’s incredibly necessary, incredibly important. And it is because it is because of you as why God made you like this. Right. It’s because of folks like this. So yeah. So. When, when you made that transition, well, we’ll take a step back. I imagine when you were a pastor, a community pastor, and then now, even when you have this mastermind group in some of these other things you’re doing.

But there are some common threads. There are some parallels, some principles that make a good community. And I think entrepreneurs in general struggle with creating community around them or implementing community around them. What are some things. If you were to reflect on it that make a good constructive community or a healthy community of any kind, are there some things that you kind of naturally apply that, you know, when you just put your, your Ellis, my non, that build things that people want to come to or are feel safe then.

Yeah. I [00:16:00] mean, I think it starts with a good leader. Like I think a good community has a good leader or leaders that really provide vision and direction for that community. And I don’t just say that for me. I, the community that I’m a part of, and then I want to be in there’s a, there’s a clear leader in someone who’s casting vision that.

It’s compelling and that people want to be a part of. And so I do think that’s key, but then that later also realizes like even, or she realizes that just because they’re leading a vision there, they’re not the most part of the community. Like it really, we really have to elevate, break people up in that.

I think vulnerability is key, but like within kind of our mastermind, but even when I was in ministry, it’s like vulnerability. And especially those who are. Either more mature or been in this longer, like the more vulnerable they are with, you know, I don’t have it all together or here, the here, my mess ups.

To really prove as an example, like maturity, we’ve become more aware of our flaws with maturity, not less, [00:17:00] right. Like that is what it means to be a Christian. Right. We see more of our need for Christ, not less. So I think vulnerability is a huge component of that. And then yeah, like similar goals, like a real focus, like what are we trying to accomplish together?

What’s our mission? What are we, what are we doing in? Because I think when we really rally around a common purpose and a common goal that really brings people together and mean, think about our mastermind community, we all, in some ways you could argue we’re competitors, we’re all trying to raise money.

We’re all trying to do deals. And so in some ways, like we’re in the same industry. But why does everyone get along and try and help and provide resources? Because we realize. We’re actually not about our own kingdom. We’re about God’s kingdom. And so there’s a real mission of like, I want to see your nails get done as much as I want to see my deals get done, because whenever you go, I know the kingdom goes there.

And so that’s been really, I think, crucial for us to really continue to try and communicate and make sure people are on board. I love that leadership, vulnerability [00:18:00] and then goals. And what I think is so interesting about having a community that has a Christ centric focus. Is that you realize that my wind is at the sake of your loss.

That’s a really important kind of, I think collaborative principle, you see it all over. I think acts for instance, where you see people coming together and they have maybe what you would perceive as being competing needs, but you see fruit regardless. And I think that’s something that’s really, really important.

And. And oftentimes kind of counter instinctual too, to kind of go after that, that I can, I can help you win and it’s not going to be at a detriment to my business. This isn’t a winner takes all type of thing, which is so typical, I think, in the business world. Yeah, a hundred percent. Ellis. One of the things I love having been a part of your community for a season was your take on impact and the way that money plays into that.

Can you share a little bit about that? Because I feel like you’ve got a, a great, a [00:19:00] great view on what. Be a little more specific. I’m like, yeah, we’re talking about the same thing. So I feel like, yeah, you and your pursuit of money deals, influence is all about impact that you can have on people, at least being kind of under your tutelage, if you will, and listening to your podcasts.

Like if I understand correctly that as you gain, even if it’s just cashflow, that’s. In a way you see that as an influence, is that correct? Yeah, that’s great, man. Well, I would say this way, I really think, and this was something I learned early, early on in my journey of entrepreneurship is that money flows to that, right?

So where one creates value, money flows. And so it’s a ridiculous question. When someone says how much money should a Christian make, because. If the principle is that money flows to value. Well, then the answer to that question should be. As much dang money as he can, because that [00:20:00] means he’s or she is producing infinite value.

And so that’s the way I think about that. And you could substitute value with impact. I mean, if really what we’re doing with real estate is we’re creating value for people. And I just don’t think those things have to be separate in that, I think. Yeah. So that, that would be one thing I say. And I talk about a lot.

Is that we have to kind of replace this idea of well, money is evil or making money as somehow through deceitful gains. I’m like, it’s not really the way that actually the world works. Yes. There are people who are, who are deceitfully earning money, but most of the people who were really successful, I’ve just figured out ways to add tremendous value, have tremendous impact in the world.

Steve jobs, bill Gates, Elon Musk, go on and on. You know what I mean? Like. Thinking about what they’ve done. They’ve literally changed industries, change lives, change the world. Right. And they’re freaking rich because of it. And it’s because money flows to value. So that would be [00:21:00] one thought I have, I can go on.

Does that helpful? No, that’s great. I mean, and that goes right with, I know when I first started my business and I was praying, one of the clear things that I heard God say is it’s all about value. He was like, I want you to make that your tagline. It’s about the value of the person that’s in front of you.

It’s about you knowing your value and it’s about bringing the most value to the person you’re there. I think that’s so good. I mean, as soon as you started sharing that, the whole verse, what does that a is. Worth is, is wages, right? Like if you’re bringing value, you’re worth those wages. Yeah. And like, so I equate an example of this is I will, with buying apartment complexes is sort of like right now we have a fund and that fund is buying apartment deals.

And we’re working with this Christian, nonprofit in our model is really to go into these residents would be a good neighbor. Right. And we’re. We’re trying to keep residents around and we’re trying to increase the reputation of our asset. Right. Which is all the reason why that’s a [00:22:00] great business model, because all of those things actually add to our NOI, right?

Because if we reduce resident turnover, then we save expenses, right. If we have a better reputation than we have, we don’t have to spend as much on marketing. And so all of these things about going into an apartment complex and adding value, being a good neighbor. Trying to impact influence people’s lives with the love of Christ.

Qatar is also a good business model. So like, yeah. That’s why I think entrepreneurship is, is a great, yeah. I hope I love this show because I think entrepreneurs are huge assets for the kingdom. I also specifically love the syndication model. Cause I feel like it’s so kingdom and that everyone gets blessed.

Like I, I see you as the person putting these things together, you get blessed because you’re bringing value. Your investors get blessed because they’re getting a return on their cash. The communities that you’re purchasing, that you’re improving, they get blessed, like. True [00:23:00] kingdom is everybody walks out a winner and I feel like your model and what you’re doing is a perfect example of that.

Yeah, I definitely, that’s why I love the model too. I agree. So talk to me about longterm because I know you’re, you’re doing the syndication thing, but you’ve also got a podcast and you’ve become for lack of a better term, a influencer and in our sphere of, uh, Christians and real estate. Talk to me about the long-term.

Where do you see that going? And how has that kind of impact what you’re doing? That’s a great question. It’s funny you say that because I definitely don’t see our brand or myself as that yet. I mean, I definitely think we’re having influence on people. I know we have a following of several hundred people that’s in our show.

But to think about over an industry, you know, I’m not quite sure because my vision is that we do, like, I want to see kingdom REI really become a leader, not just in the Christian world, but in the real estate industry, a large of, we are one of the. Top providers [00:24:00] of real estate education, but we, we have like, we’re worried about the kingdom and I just think it would basically, you have all these other great companies out there, but to show that the reason we want to be excellent is because of Christ.

Right? And so I think, you know, REI is definitely in its beginning right now we have the mastermind, but there’s so much more than I think Kmart really I can become for this industry. And I, when I think about our mastermind, like. But I’d love to have a community that has a hundred billion dollars of real estate across the United States.

And all of these operators are really, are really acting and operating with kingdom principles because I mean, that would just be a massive impact thousands and thousands of people’s lives, you know, under the care of owners that really. We really do care and are really trying to create value in these apartments.

So again, all of these things are not things I can do on my own, which is kind of why it’s hard to answer that question because we’re pretty early in. I see what it could be. I just don’t know how to get there yet. And [00:25:00] in a lot of these ways. And so, you know, on the investment side of things, same thing, man.

We’re just trying to prove this model. Like we’re trying to just get the deal’s done. It’s see. And still prove the model in so many ways. And so. I see what it could be. I definitely think all of these things are, are great business models and can be super successful, but we’re still early men and still trying to figure it out in a lot of ways.

So Ellis, tell me, so we’ve talked about some of your, your wins. Can you talk about some of those losses, some of those as I like to call them learning opportunities that you’ve had since switching into this entrepreneurial? Yeah, I was gave up. It was probably like. Four or five months into this and, um, specifically on King REI.

And, uh, again, like there’s an investment to be a part of the community. And we met a lot of people and we already kind of had like a small core, but we really wanted to kind of bring in another group. And I just kinda remember calling a lot of people that man, it’s a great idea. I love it. But in COVID like middle of COVID and like, no one’s doing deals and like industry real estate [00:26:00] industry is like frozen and, uh, To be honest with you.

Like, again, I kind of out of money, she knows like, I mean, this is like where our business was. Like, we couldn’t really grow anymore. And so we were just stuck in so many ways. And I remember going to a lot of folks and like, Hey, like you want to be part of this? And I got a lot of no’s just because it wasn’t, I know your idea sucks.

It was more like, just not good timing. And I really wasn’t in a position to wait two months or three months. And I just remember kind of laying on the floor. Well, this is it like, dang, this is a good run, but I just, you know, we’ll talk about this at the end of the show, but one of my kind of core values or kind of principles is just never, ever give up.

And, um, I just remember thinking, all right, wait, what do we got to do? And I think it was a real turning point for me because. What happened when I said, I’m not going to give up, instead of saying, well, let’s just see what happens in two months. And no, we got to figure this out today. I remember getting on the phone with my partner and us coming [00:27:00] up with an offer in the, in the eight or nine people that said no to me, the past couple of days, I called them all that day.

And seven out of eight of them said yes to our new offer. And we were. Since you were able to bring it. And honestly that lot’s just from eight people to 40 people today. And so that kind of one transition, so, or that one pivot. So that was a turning point of like realizing as an entrepreneur. That’s not going to be the only time I’m probably on my back, but I’ll always remember that because I’m like, I remember thinking like, you know what?

I think this is, this would be a turning point that I’ll look back on for a long time. It was one of those moments. I’m like, man, I’m glad I didn’t give up. And part of entrepreneurship is not giving up and knowing them pivot. And, um, that was a big one, man. I love that story. That is, that is some hustle and some really cool sticktuitiveness I don’t think you see super often.

I, uh, man, how did you can without going into too much detail. So you go back [00:28:00] to the same people after they just told you all like that’s and by the way, like. If you have any kind of data research background, you go to a whole like, basically set of people and you’re like, Hey, buy this. I’m like, yeah, no way.

And then you go back to them like the same day. And you’re like, what about this? And like, Yeah, we can do that. Typically, if you think about the psychology of saying no, if you already said no once, you’re probably going to say no again. So even overcoming that in your own mind and then helping them overcome that too.

I mean, that’s pretty cool. No one can take that away from you. And I know it’s more than that, but it’s still really neat. Well, I knew he had something of value, man. I just had to get people in the door and, um, and so it was figuring out. No, I’m not tell our it’s not like they were gonna be mad at me telling me any, Joe, Joe knows this.

Joe said yes to the offer. It was before it was pay everything upfront. And then we S we’ve changed our model to pay a little bit now and then pay everything later. Right. Come taste and see. And, and it’s almost like, listen, I’ll take the risk [00:29:00] right before it was, the risk is on you. Because it’s money to be a part of this.

And if you don’t show up or whatever, then you’re out, you’ve lost money. But now I changed it. Say another risk is on it. It’s like, come in, we’re given everything for, I mean, almost free on giving you access to everything, our entire network, all of our connections. And if it’s not good, then leave no harm, no foul.

And that changed it all because then it was like, well, I know people want to be in this, but they’re still like, Oh, I’m not sure. And we just made it such a no-brainer that almost no one says no anymore. It’s almost like, well, yeah, that makes sense. Why would I not? You know what I mean? And so. I don’t know why it took me so long to figure that out, but it just, it did.

And I’m thankful. Well, I’m thankful that you even presented it that way, because I think there could be kind of a real sort of tendency to say, well, you know, if it didn’t work the first time and it’s just a bad idea, or there’s just not anything [00:30:00] there. And if you’re creating a new offer or you don’t have a lot of background in creating products, there can be this kind of the sense of just like, well, I tried it and it’s not going to work.

Well, that’s not even just giving up too quickly, maybe there’s room to grow and just you understanding how to present. Something, the biggest companies in the world, they refactor something 10 times over a few years in order to get it boiled down to the most perfect offer. And then it sells like hotcakes and people think they just hit gold.

No, they refactored whatever that offer was a few times before they got to it. And it’s just kind of having that, that long game, that long tail perspective that, uh, is really super beneficial. And it, I think you for sharing your story, because I think. People just think, well, this is mastermind is number one.

Mastermind grew up out of nothing because Ellis came down from on high with this great apartment complex perspective. And now there was some, there was some give and take in there. There was some push. Yeah. I don’t know anybody who, I [00:31:00] mean, I’m sure there are people come out the gate screaming, but.

Definitely not us. And, uh, and here’s the thing, I don’t know when this show is going to come out, so I don’t really care anyways, but w we’re not out the Gates man. We’re out to come out with this new offer for 20, 21 and I’m to have you back on, because I’m not sure if it’s going to organize it in a couple of weeks and be like, dang, that didn’t work out so well.

So we’ll see, man, we’ll see. We’re there. This is the fun part of being an entrepreneur is it’s creating something that you think is valuable putting out to the world. And selling it and, uh, we’re still selling this vision. We got something special that people should be a part of. Yeah, absolutely.

Entrepreneurship is a commitment to being experimental. Uh, think we’d like to forego that, but it’s true. Well, Hey Ellis. I want to honor your time. Unfortunately, we’ve got to go into it. Well, not, unfortunately, fortunately, we’ve got to go into the final five for our last couple of minutes and, uh, well, we will have a bonus one, uh, update for everyone back in [00:32:00] 2021 to see how that offer panned out.

But for our final five minutes, we have our final five questions. Question number one, Ellis. What are your top three must read books, not including the Bible. And these can be business family. Spiritual cookbook. First book is mindset and psychology of success. Second book would be thinking grow rich. Third book will be 10 X by grant Cardone.

Can you tell me the first one has that’s by. The psychologist. I can’t tell you the name of, okay, it’s fine. I’ll I’ll uh, I’ll Google it and I’ll have it in the show notes for everybody. And the second one is Napoleon Hill. Just as a way for those listening question, number two, you can send a note card back to yourself when you’re first starting off on your entrepreneurial journey.

What are the three pieces of advice you’re putting on that card? I mean, I would just, first one would be, don’t give up pivot sooner and then don’t give up, like, here’s this thing, isn’t that complicated man. Like, it’s like. Don’t give up pivot and don’t give [00:33:00] up, like, there’s just, it’s, there’s really not that complicated.

I do think the, um, let me actually go back because that’s really not helpful for anyone listening, but I think not giving up is actually very important because too many people give up too soon. Another great book. Number four would be three feet from gold. Another great book. I do think pivoting is key.

And in this journey, I think learning sales and marketing is what, what out of it? Like. Go all in on sales and marketing, like learn, become, learn sales sooner, like learn how to sell. Like you need a tr you need to be trained on how to sell Atlas. You’re not a good salesman. You’re a good evangelist, but you’re not a good sales.

And that’s the difference. There’s a difference there. So I think right now we’re doing sales, training and marketing. So I just think that would be a third one. Like start learning sales and marketing right away. And when you say pivot, can you unpack that just a little bit more? Do you just mean when things aren’t working pivot or do you, there’s a difference when I say don’t give up doesn’t mean, like, we’ll just keep doing the same thing over and over again.

Right? Like it’s knowing [00:34:00] when you have to change your offer or when something’s not working and we’ll just, don’t keep doing it, like figure out what needs to change. Right. And so we’re experiencing the same thing on our other business with in buying apartments. It’s like, we’re not really getting the deals.

That we want to be getting, so what do we got to do? Do we need to be, we’ve got to figure out how do we get more off more projects in to make more offers and so raising art, you know, and that might pivot why I need to raise my commitment to this. So that’s what I mean. Awesome. That’s really good. Thanks for the clarification question.

Number three. How do you define success for yourself? It really simply, man, the way I did the way you asked that question upon success for myself is just doing what I say. I think every day, you know, I write down my top three goals, what I want to accomplish for the day. And then I do that for the week and I have that for the month.

And if I can do those things and I’m going to be successful, cause I’ve already mapped it out. So. That it’s really simply just doing what I say I’m going to do is really what [00:35:00] success looks like. I love it. It’s just, yeah. Being in having integrity with yourself. That’s awesome. Question number four. When times have gotten tough.

What has kept you from quitting? It’s a good question, man. I mean, I think it’s my faith, my faith in God that he’s with me, that he’s called me to something bigger than faith in myself. Right. That I know who God’s created me and I can, I can do this. And then. Just, I don’t want to lose, man. I like the most competitive person ever.

Like I don’t, I, I don’t, I, I, this is not very spiritual. Like I don’t want to lose, I don’t want to let people down. I don’t want to let myself download my wife down. I don’t want to lose, so you really have to beat me, you know, like it’s going to be really hard to beat me from a long-term perspective.

Cause like we’re not really have a hard time giving up cause I just don’t wanna lose. So that would be it. Man you answering this question. And then the one from a couple of before, uh, [00:36:00] reminding me so much, I’m watching that the Michael Jordan documentary a couple of months late, but I’m watching episode five.

About once a week, because it literally like episode five is just like triggers me of like this, this guy gets fired up the guy from a he’s a killer man. And like, I don’t know if selfie, but it gets me pumped up man. And like, it gets me ready for the week. So episode five, the series is amazing. And, uh, I watched it a lot cause I’m like that dude has the mindset of like what I’m talking about.

Like he refused to give up. Any, he was obsessed and he was committed to something and it’s inspiring. And most people might look at that and hate him for that. But I’m like, it’s also why we’re still talking about why each show about why he’s inspired the entire world. Right? Like it, because he was committed and he didn’t give up.

Man. I, I feel like we could do a whole episode, uh, just on, uh, how [00:37:00] to apply the Michael Jordan documentary and mindset to the Christian entrepreneurial walk. A hundred percent man, a hundred percent. I’m ready to go around with too. Cause he’s the same. That’s awesome. All right. Question. Let’s see here. I guess we’re on question number five.

What is, what questions should we have asked that we didn’t, um, you guys asked some great questions. Yeah. I mean, you, you know, I don’t, I don’t know. I just think, I guess the last thing I would say is you, I had the chain, you already asked this in some way, but that was so important to remember is thinking about.

Me and my wife, like she’s spent incredible support in all of this and just remember what’s important and why you’re doing it. And for me, it’s been been my wife and my family, my mom and my brother. Those are the things that really keep me motivated as well. And just having them, them in mind and knowing why we’re doing this, having a support and really staying invested in those relationships.

Yeah. I just can’t [00:38:00] imagine if we accomplished everything we wanted to accomplish in the next 12 months. And then I didn’t have those relationships. Like what would be the point of any of this? Right. Like one of my biggest goals to make any money in the next couple of months is just so I can bounce them off the house.

You know what I mean? Like, so like, it just is, I don’t know, remembering those things, I don’t even know. I mean, just like those are the things that really are important. I think as being connected to those things is what makes you a powerful person? No, that’s so good. And I think that’s a, a great place to leave it at there.

Ellis. Thank you so much for coming on the Eternal Entrepreneur, man. Before we go, you got to tell us for all those pastors out there who need that change of mindset, how can they find out more about you? How can they start investing? Yeah, well, if that’s what you want, I wrote a book on this called The Mission of Multifamily.

It’s called mission and multifamily, and you can go to mission of multifamily doc, um, and actually download a free copy right now, just my [00:39:00] story. But I talk a lot about what we talked about today, the money mindset that had a shift in the things we had overcome. This is a more detailed version of my story, but I wrote in such a way, I hope to really inspire others that are doing this and, uh, And then our, our mastermind, you can learn more at the kingdom.

rei.com is where is where we have that hosted. And then our Ellis Hammond. My name Ellis hammond.com is kind of my investor website for folks who want to learn more about investing with us real estate deals. So three lanes, mission multifamily, the kingdom, REI and ellishammond.com are all those three places to go.